Poor Workmanship

[joemusic321]

I pressured up my fresh water system with the pump today and it would cycle off and on every 10 minutes or so. Being the genius I am, I surmised a leak After taking half the inside of the camper apart, I found nothing. After a few hours, however, I noticed water dripping from under the trailer. Great, now I have to lay on my back underneath, with limited possibility of getting back up, and start removing the protective covering in the suspected area of the leak. It's out of warranty by the way.

Long story short, after removing the soaked insulation, I found the leak was in the line going from the fresh water tank to a tee behind the bulkhead in the front storage compartment. When I cut out the leaking section, I found that it had apparently been hit with a saw sometime during construction (see attached photo).The sad part is, whoever did it knew he did it. The section where the saw cut it was covered in some type of glue. I can only guess that when they pressure tested the system (I assume they pressure test), they found the leak and made this "destined for failure" repair.

As an aside, it's amazing how much poor craftsmanship you can find when you have to take things apart. Is there no pride left in American workers?

[mike06081969]

I hate that you had this trouble, but it is good that you caught it before it did much damage. On the bright side, it gave you a chance to do a thorough inspection of the undercarriage.

[Bert]

It's a shame this happened. Unfortunately many people just don't care. I'm a small business owner and it's tough to find good help. Let Crossroads know and tell them specifically what unit you have and vin#. If it were my company I would want to trace it back who did it.

[joemusic321]

I did fire off an email to Crossroads. I don't expect anything in return, however. This is the fourth RV I've owned and each and every one has had some area(s) of pitiful workmanship. One example (from among many) on the previous one before this Cruiser was they just ran the coax from the antenna to the connector in the trailer without even stripping the wire on either end. I don't think doing a prideful job costs more than a sloppy one.

[MEHoffman]

There are people who believe that quality is the enemy of production.
Personally I suffered for many years as a perfectionist before I learned to back off and strike a balance.

[socoguy]

Originally Posted by Bert

It's a shame this happened. Unfortunately many people just don't care. I'm a small business owner and it's tough to find good help. Let Crossroads know and tell them specifically what unit you have and vin#. If it were my company I would want to trace it back who did it.

Unfortunatly it is probably the fault of the manufacturer. So much pressure (piece work) is put on the assembly line to turn out product. The individual has to perform or be replaced so mistakes are hidden or not reported.
It is not the auto industry there is no standard applied or enforced. We are at the mercy of the manufactures phone calls are our best course of action as feeble as that may be.
Ther have been some recent reports of better customer service lets hope that trend continues.

[kaiserrw1]

I have a CR28CK that is an '04 model and was built under the direction of original mfg owners vision of producing a quality RV. Even with that vision there were "issues" with this unit, a couple being routine like fresh water tanks being installed with less than sufficient support to prevent failure. That was an R&D/QC failure. The installation of improper axles was a failure of a supplier to maintain QC; which was not Crossroad's "fault", but yet caused Crossroads to suffer financial consequences.

The lack of quality products are not always easily traced to a cause, but when sloppy craftsmanship occurs at the assembly point there typically is an underlying reason as some stated before me.

Sometimes a problem gives the RV owner an opportunity to learn how their unit is made and how to make it better. That is the approach I take with my RV, for instance the original shirt closets in the CR28CK were not deep enough to allow use of a regular clothes hanger; thus I took out the front of the bedroom and rebuilt it using real wood (oak ply) increasing the closet and overhead compartment depth 2 1/2". Crossroads RV provided original construction drawings so I could determine where structural supports were. I suspect the current ownership would not do that today. At the time CR and I maintained contact and they made a change in their design as a result.

There also has been an obvious change in customer service relations at CR over the years that seems not for the better, except in a few cases recently. One person noted it is difficult to find employees that care about the work they do. Another person stated they used to be a perfectionist and has learned to back off and strike a balance. I too am a perfectionist and have been forced to accept less. It seems to me that is how our country has gotten where it is ...... striving for mediocrity. Not what our forefathers had in their minds when defining "success".

With all this said, please let today's management of Crossroads RV (Thor Indust) know what you expect in regard to QC and product reliability. Also use each issue as "another learning opportunity" and I believe you'll enjoy your RV more when you have the pride of knowing all you can know about it.

[joemusic321]

Originally Posted by kaiserrw1

I have a CR28CK that is an '04 model and was built under the direction of original mfg owners vision of producing a quality RV. Even with that vision there were "issues" with this unit, a couple being routine like fresh water tanks being installed with less than sufficient support to prevent failure. That was an R&D/QC failure. The installation of improper axles was a failure of a supplier to maintain QC; which was not Crossroad's "fault", but yet caused Crossroads to suffer financial consequences.

The lack of quality products are not always easily traced to a cause, but when sloppy craftsmanship occurs at the assembly point there typically is an underlying reason as some stated before me.

Sometimes a problem gives the RV owner an opportunity to learn how their unit is made and how to make it better. That is the approach I take with my RV, for instance the original shirt closets in the CR28CK were not deep enough to allow use of a regular clothes hanger; thus I took out the front of the bedroom and rebuilt it using real wood (oak ply) increasing the closet and overhead compartment depth 2 1/2". Crossroads RV provided original construction drawings so I could determine where structural supports were. I suspect the current ownership would not do that today. At the time CR and I maintained contact and they made a change in their design as a result.

There also has been an obvious change in customer service relations at CR over the years that seems not for the better, except in a few cases recently. One person noted it is difficult to find employees that care about the work they do. Another person stated they used to be a perfectionist and has learned to back off and strike a balance. I too am a perfectionist and have been forced to accept less. It seems to me that is how our country has gotten where it is ...... striving for mediocrity. Not what our forefathers had in their minds when defining "success".

With all this said, please let today's management of Crossroads RV (Thor Indust) know what you expect in regard to QC and product reliability. Also use each issue as "another learning opportunity" and I believe you'll enjoy your RV more when you have the pride of knowing all you can know about it.

I, too, had the problem with the fresh water tank. It didn't fall out and hit the road but it came close. I've owned RVs for about 30 years so this is not my first rodeo. I've learned a lot but mostly, quality seems to be a thing of the past.

[kaiserrw1]

I could expound on quality issues in numerous fields until everyone is bored to tears. We saw it in the 50's/60's/70's with automobiles until Honda, Isuzu, Toyota, etc. ate our lunch and finally the auto industry (along with the workers) had to admit our products were inferior. Our country has made great strides in some fields; however, our Fed Gvt continues to push not only gvt entities, but private businesses to accept mediocrity. Sometimes it is done in subtle ways, ie who a private business owner can/will hire & retain. Over the years the pursuit of "dumbing down" has resulted in people not understanding or believing that inferior work is ... "inferior", so now acceptance of poor quality is expected.

The RV industry has always had the stigma of perceived low quality. At times a new "start up" appears that promises to be different, and is for a while it seems. Eventually, something happens and that dedication seems to waiver - possibly in an attempt to produce units at "x to y" retail selling price range. For those of us that are good with our hands, we can normally compensate for shortfalls in mfg production. It's just unfortunate we are forced to do so. After reviewing all the RV mfg's that once existed and are no longer around, it seems to me someone would change the business model. That's not to say there are none producing quality units, there are ...... mostly out of my price range.

[malojeer]

I just came back from Bouque Chitto State Park and found the bed had pulled away from the wall in the master bedroom slide. I fixed it but the quality of wood used was pathetic. A wood pallet is made out of better quality wood than what is used in the build of an RV. I know I worked at a manufactured home factory and it is just plain dumb what is allowed to leave the factory.

[kaiserrw1]

malojeer - many folks don't know nor understand the old phrase: "my perception of your low quality is my reality". Exactly what puts companies out of business. I'm interested in knowing what make/model RV you have.

Another R&R with my CR28K was the kitchen due to drawer slides being attached to air and a split bottom brace screwed to the floor. Those issues were easily corrected since I build kitchen cabinets. For folks that are not good with their hands and/or do not have the tools to repair these things, I feel sorry for them.

The RV industry is always trying to build units as light as possible, thus the crappy "wood" that is used often times has a propensity to be ....... well ..... crappy ! With the rebuild of the bedroom area in my 28CK, CR was concerned about the added weight red oak and oak ply would add to the unit. When it was all finished the unit had gained 57 lbs. (Per CAT scales) Not much for building with quality materials. The porcelain toilet that replaced the plastic one added almost that much weight.

Just remember .... an RV is a hobby of it's own.

[malojeer]

We have an 08 CF32BL. I really like our rv but its constantly fixing small things that start to wear on a person. The plastic ends that the drawer runners slide into break so often I keep 2 sets of spares in the fiver. We recently went to an rv show in Houma Louisiana and the quality has only gotten worse since we bought ours. I don't think I would buy another Crossroads product until they improve the quality at least to the level of our 08.

[lcrver]

Originally Posted by socoguy

Unfortunatly it is probably the fault of the manufacturer. So much pressure (piece work) is put on the assembly line to turn out product. The individual has to perform or be replaced so mistakes are hidden or not reported.
It is not the auto industry there is no standard applied or enforced. We are at the mercy of the manufactures phone calls are our best course of action as feeble as that may be.
Ther have been some recent reports of better customer service lets hope that trend continues.

Find it hard to believe there are reports of improved customer service. I have been trying for over a year now to get them to follow through on a commitment to pick up my unit and make repairs because of imperfections in the fiberglass sidewalls.

[tomandlori]

On the drawer slide issue, try looking in the back of the drawer. Our track went into the plastic bracket only about 1/2 inch, so bouncing down the road broke the plastic pieces mounted in the back. I had to replace all the brackets, and move the back forward and inforce the mounting of that backing. Hope this helps.

[tomandlori]

I too am at a loss for poor workmanship at Crossroads. I am an auto repair tech for 22 years at the same shop. My boss and us 3 techs there take pride in our work. Right on the building it states " If you are not completely satisfied, Please come back for us to fix it" If it does come back, it better not be a third time.

[sleepyT]

Originally Posted by anaro

Post deleted at request of user.

Aileen
I think you should read the lead post on this thread as it is NOT a positive post.

[anaro]

oops sorry I meant to put this in a different thread..... I was meaning to reply to the excellent crossroads service post. My apologies. I will ask for a delete.

[lrrwoodard]

I think they should be shot for leaving all that sawdust in the trailer. It constantly blow out while towing. This is our third year and still have sawdust crawling out of hidden spaces.

[sunset4K]

Hi Everyone, As a current Heartland owner considering a Rushmore, I have been lurking around here for a while. First I can tell you that our 2013 Heartland Elkridge spent almost 3 months in and out of the dealer for repairs during the first year we owned it...so I believe the poor workmanship issues are industry wide. Our problems began day one when after 5 days on the road we discovered that the shower drain pipe was never hooked up to the shower pan at the factory so the water drained into the underbelly!!! That was one of only 27 items on the FIRST repair list. Its back in for more warranty work now with a total of 12 things. My husband has replaced all the drawer slides with better ones. He reinstalled all the drawer bottoms by gluing and re-stapling them.

Having said all this, I am most concerned about the many posts I have read that the Crossroads company is not responding to requests for assistance from owners. Heartland does appear to be more responsive, based on what I read on their forum and how they have handled our warranty issues.

While we love the Washington floorplan and it would work so much better for us than our ELkridge floorplan, we are really taking a step back at this point before going forward with the Rushmore purchase. Very concerned at what we are reading here....

[WildWildWest]

Originally Posted by sunset4K

Hi Everyone, As a current Heartland owner considering a Rushmore, I have been lurking around here for a while. First I can tell you that our 2013 Heartland Elkridge spent almost 3 months in and out of the dealer for repairs during the first year we owned it...so I believe the poor workmanship issues are industry wide. Our problems began day one when after 5 days on the road we discovered that the shower drain pipe was never hooked up to the shower pan at the factory so the water drained into the underbelly!!! That was one of only 27 items on the FIRST repair list. Its back in for more warranty work now with a total of 12 things. My husband has replaced all the drawer slides with better ones. He reinstalled all the drawer bottoms by gluing and re-stapling them.

Having said all this, I am most concerned about the many posts I have read that the Crossroads company is not responding to requests for assistance from owners. Heartland does appear to be more responsive, based on what I read on their forum and how they have handled our warranty issues.

While we love the Washington floorplan and it would work so much better for us than our ELkridge floorplan, we are really taking a step back at this point before going forward with the Rushmore purchase. Very concerned at what we are reading here....

I agree manufacturing issues are industry wide. Quantity over quality these days. CrossRoads went through a period of one or two years that were quite poor in regards to response to owners concerns and warranty issues. More recently - the last six to to twelve months there have been some changes in management again and there seems to be much more success in dealing with the manufacturer. That being said, there are always going to be several cases where things are not handled well. I think the best advice is to make sure you use a great dealer. Too many dealers only want to sell units and could care less once you leave the lot. Good dealers work on the owners behalf with warranty claims and not saying this is always necessary but can help. Many members have done well dealing directly with CrossRoads. Our dealer is 850 miles away and we have just dealt directly with CrossRoads on the one minor issue we had and it was taken care of quickly. That being said, we had a great experience with our dealer and this was the second unit we purchased from them so if anything major came up we would have had no problem going through them.