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Old 09-01-2013, 02:05 PM   #1
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Location: Saskatchewan
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Well, we bought our CF345RF Patriot back in October last year and we went on our annual 30 day RV trip in August of this year. 4,500 miles later and living in it for one month, I thought I would write out my impressions (good and bad) of the unit. Travelled from Saskatoon, SK Canada to West Yellowstone,Montana toSalt Lake City,Utah toMoab,Utah to Cheyenne, Wyoming to Hill City, South Dakota to Waskesiu Lake,SKand back home to Saskatoon, SK.

I did several upgrades before we even slept one night in the unit, including strengthening the bed supports, JT Strongarm stabilizers, hard-wired surge protector, hose reel in cargo bay, new taps in kitchen and bath, Oxygenics shower head, and installed a water filter.

Prior to leaving, I couldn't get the water pump to provide a steady flow, spurts and starts and won't build pressure and shut off. I am going to take it apart and see if its plugged or is just bad. Warranty should replace it if bad.We had all full service sites booked so I was hoping we wouldn't need to use it even though I dragged 25 gallons of water along with us in the tank.

Wife and I spent 30 nights in the unit and the bed is stable with the upgrades - no sagging or other issues - glad I modified it before leaving - could probably use a mattresstopper although I slept well but it took my wife some getting used to- we have the memory foam pillow top queen size mattress.

Had water escaping the underside after driving through a major rainstorm - wasn't sure when it was leaking out but that must have been the problem - no leak after the water drained out so the gaps beside the slides must let enough rain in from the wheels to put a fair bit of water into the sealed underside portion. Plan to try and seal the gaps a little better where the slide goes in to avoid this in the future.

Not too happy that my axles are only 5,200 lb rating given a total GVWR of 12,300 lbs, but I kept a close eye on my tires and no uneven wear - alignment appears good. Happy to see this as we plan on towing to Alaska next year and that is another 5,000 mile trip. Tire wear is so so - expect I may replace the tires with LT tires before heading to Alaska but we will see how they look in spring - I never expect to get more than 10,000 miles out of these cheap Chinese crap tires they put on the trailers. They must assume people do not haul long distances with these units - more likely they just cheap out on the tires. I'd rather have quality tires and no worries than cheap crap that I constantly worry about a blowout. Weighed unit on leaving and the trailer was at a total weight of 11,900 lbs with all of our gear and 25 gallons of freshwater.

Anyway, trying not to be too longwinded - the following are all we found as negatives - pretty small things and we feel fortunate that our unit has been well built.

Shelf is pretty lightweight in the island - broke on one rough road portion of the trip and I had to fix it in the campground - strengthened it in the process so it won't fall again. Amazing that none of the pantry shelves fell - had a lot of weight on them but they stood up to the abuse.

Aluminum skirt around this trailer is pretty light gauge - leaned a chair against the outside and it put a dent in it - wish this was heavier gauge - I can crease it with my finger.

Sawdust coming out of who knows where every time we drove - wife had to vacuum every time we stopped - can't even tell where it's coming from.

Black sink in bathroom is nearly impossible to keep clean and so small like a postage stamp- ordered a new larger sink from CW while camping and will install this fall.

Black Corian (cultured granite) countertops are a pain to keep clean - they look great but the wife had her hands full keeping them looking perfect!!

Broke off the fresh water tank drain raising the rear stabilizers in Cheyenne, Wyoming and left 25 gallons of fresh water on the campground and out to the highway. I had been keeping my eye on the close clearances of the rear stabilizers and the pex pipe hanging down for thetank drain prior to that but it managed to clear it every time - not that time. Had to fix it when we got home - fortunately it didn't break anything, just pulled out the threaded pipe- added a longer piece of pex pipe for the drain - now angled away from stabilizers and will not have that problem again - easy fix but one that you shouldn't have to make.

Bathroom furnaceregister didn't have a shut off and that little room heated like a sauna when the furnace ran - bought one in Salt Lake at Camping World and replaced with one that shuts off - problem solved and more even heat distribution in trailer. Found one that shuts off in the living room area so I am guessing that they just put it in the wrong location - somewhat of a stupid mistake - two in the living room four feet apart and one with a shut off? Seems obvious that wouldn't go there. Oh well - $10 for a new register with damper.

Dining room/living slide seal started creaping down and out of its track out past the back of the slide while driving - the top seal on the sloped big slide. Had to open the slide a couple of inches twice and keep positioning it back up the track. Once we stopped, the rubber had torn away from the screws. Put a washer on the screw at theeach end and also added a second screw to hold it and repaired the silicone seal on the end - no more movements after that. Just one of those things that there isn't a lot holding it one there - should be better secured

That was about itfor bad - all our slides worked perfectly - we have remote operation on them all and none are Schwintek which makes me happy, happy, happy!!

Kept the tap pressure a little lower at the campgrounds and my hose reel mod never leaked after our first stop in West Yellowstone - I have a pressure regulator but also just turned the tap on part way and didn't crank it wide open. Happy with this!! Still had plenty of pressure for showering, etc.

JT Stabilizers take out about 80% of the movement - maybe a little less but are significantly better than nothing. Surge protector worked flawlessly.

Spent about 20 of our 30 nights in 86 degree to 100 degree heat in West Yellowstone, Salt Lake and Moab. Air conditioner (single ducted) kept up very well - trailer never got warmer than 77 degrees any day and we keep it set at 75 degrees for cooling when we were camping in high temps. At this point, I don't see a need for a 2nd AC as we don't live in a southern climate with continuous temps at those levels.

Overall review of this trailer is good to excellent- I feel fortunate that the build quality on our unit is reasonable - obviously a few things need to be improved from factory such as the bed supports - glad we upgraded ours before using it. No other major negatives with the unit than those little things mentioned above. We came from a 2008 Fleetwood TerryExtreme Edition that wasextremely well built.

Given what I have read on here, I was a little worried aboutgoing out on the road for 30 days without a major problem, but I'm happy to say that other than some small things, the trailer worked very well and we went over some pretty rough roads in the process and nothing too major came apart.

Sorry for the length - just wanted to give a positive review of our unit and we look forward to getting 7 to 10 years of use out it. I did a lot of research before purchasing our CrossRoads Cruiser and their previous quality was one of the reasons I went with them-I was a little nervous after reading some of the problems that have been occurring over the last year or so with quality issues but happy to say we are still very happy with our unit.





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2013 CrossRoads Cruiser Patriot CF345RF
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Old 09-02-2013, 12:36 AM   #2
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Scott welcome home after a great trip. Thanks for the indepth report. Nice to hear good news. I have followed your posts and you prepared well. Nice and practical mods. We also are enjoying what seems to be a well built unit (9000 mile of travel) only minor stuff.
Lets face it if you can tackle the minor stuff yourself it makes for a better experience.
Definately get the mattress topper it works.
Go well.
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Old 09-02-2013, 01:08 AM   #3
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Good review. Glad you had a safe trip.

Looked at the model you purchased - wished we had - - no <!--if gte mso 9>
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The water tank drain is in a poor location - not sure how to re-route it. Ours is by the stabilizer too but has just enough clearance to prevent damage.

I made the modification to the bed after our trip - wished we had made it before. Too much sagging with the thin plywood that they put on the bed - and then with a seam down the middle that made it even worse.

Prior to the Alaska trip I would add a wet bolt kit for the suspension. The trip will give it a good work out.

On our return leg of our western trip we ran into a couple from north east New York that were on their way home from Alaska. The traveled in the late spring going there. The did not tow a car which made the trip easier and one less vehicle to worry about. The only problem they had was a cracked windshield - cracked in 4 places. Rocks thrown for big rigs. On the way home they were stopping at the motor home manufacturer for a new windshield.




Edited by: NorskeNY
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Old 09-02-2013, 01:14 AM   #4
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I also meant to comment on the faux leather recliners - they didn't fall apart and actually became more comfortable after using them for some time. I will likely upgrade in the future, but don't see a need immediately for that. Would prefer swivel rocker recliners but that can wait. As poorly built as they look, they held up very well.
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Old 09-02-2013, 01:22 AM   #5
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Meant to ask:
How did you like towing with the diesel?
Do you use a pin support too or just the JT Strongarm stabilizers?

Glad we had the diesel for our trip - tow haul mode and exhaust brake worked great.

If I ever need new axles I will install 7000lb ones. That may require new wheels too - I think the 7000 axles have wheels with the 8 bolt pattern.


Edited by: NorskeNY
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Old 09-02-2013, 01:23 AM   #6
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The wet bolt kit is on my "to do" list. No squeaking or nasty sounds on this trip, but I am sure the nylon bushings haven't worn out yet.

As many issues as we hear on the forums, I am sure there are many more who are happy with their units who don't post here. We ran into a lot of happy CrossRoads owners on our trip (Zingers, Z1's, Sunset Trails, and Rushmore)and many were not aware there was even an online forum. The fellow next to me in West Yellowstone was on his way to pick up a Rushmore Lincoln and he isn't too computer savvy so I doubt he will joint the website but I gave him some heads up on things to look for and to make sure they do a proper PDI. They use their unit 6 months of the year so hopefully it is up to spec for him.

We saw 2 unitsalmost identical toours travelling together in Hill City,SD - looked like 2014 335's or 345's - I was driving and didn't get a good look. Sure makes your head turn in a hurry when you see two of the painted ones travelling together like that!!
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Old 09-02-2013, 01:37 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NorskeNY
Meant to ask:
How did you like towing with the diesel?
Do you use a pin support too or just the JT Strongarm stabilizers?

Glad we had the diesel for our trip - tow haul mode and exhaust brake worked great.

I love my truck - towed our 8,000lb TT to New York and up to Ottawa and back last year with it and you didn't know it was behind us- we had a NOX sensor in the DPFgo out in Indianapolis on our way down that shut us down for two days last year but gave us a chance to do the track tour at Indy and see the museum. Averaged 14 mpg with the smaller trailer last year. Still had warranty so hadn't done the emissions mods yet as follows.

I have 90,000 miles on my truck and have done some serious modifications to it over the past few years some before warranty like the air bags and shocks- Upgraded to H&amp;S MiniMaxx Race Tuner, DPF Delete, EGR Cooler Delete, S&amp;B Intake, Firestone Air Bags with Airlift Wireless Air, 50 Gallon Titan Fuel Tank, Bilstein shocks and steering stabilizerand several additional mods. Without the DPF (Diesel Particulate Filter), I had no worries about the NOX sensors and no longer require DEF. Averaged 12.1 mpg this year with the heavier trailer and no issues with the truck whatsoever. Unloaded I get 21 mpg with the modifications on the highway and about 17 mpg in the city.

My truck ran flawlessly with the large 5th wheel behind it. We maintained 60mph up 8% grades for miles on end through Montana, Utah and Colorado. Engine Oil Temps a couple of times into the 240's but cooled quickly once cresting.

Ford doesn't actually use a real exhaust brake - the combination of engine braking with transmission shifting in tow haul mode is their answer to that and it works well going down steep grades and stopping when you apply the brakes.

We didn't use any pin support- only the JT Strongarm stabilizers - had a number of people checking them out and asking me questions on them who use pin stabilizers and overall I see no need for a king pin stabilizer with the JT Strongarms.


Edited by: WildWildWest
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Old 09-02-2013, 01:47 AM   #8
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I am sure the mods made a big improvement - only 30,000 miles on our truck and is still stock - engine and exhaust wise. I have an Edge Insight CTS that I use to monitor engine/tranny parameters.

The Chevy exhaust brake is similar - grade braking on the tranny and vane adjustment on the turbo for engine braking. Much better than the Chevy 2005 Duramax/Allison I had before for a tow rig.

I may install the JT Strongarms. My pin stabilizer tripod is made of steel and a little bit a pain to set up and take down. Did you install the JT Strongarms yourself?
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Old 09-02-2013, 02:06 AM   #9
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I installed the JT Strongarms myself and did the four at the front and the two at the rear (all 6). Because of the location of the propane pipe on the driver side, I had to tap the two holes for the bolts on that side(inside edge). The other side I was just able to drill through and access the bolts on the outside of the I beam. For the front centre connections I had to move the spare tire back two inches - drilled two holes - easy job.


Also didn't experience any significant chucking with only the TrailAir pin box. We have a Reese Elite 18K Slider hitch with underbed mountsin the truck which does have 4 motion movement on the head and there were only a few times we noticed any chucking at all - don't see a need to upgrade the pin box with this weight of trailer. I would want something with better design if I were hauling 15,500 lbs.
Edited by: WildWildWest
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Old 09-02-2013, 02:55 AM   #10
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Just ordered the JT Strongarms from Tweetys.com. Looks like I will need to move the spare tire back too. have a similar layout of the gas lines.

Chucking - I have <!--if gte mso 9>
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Bob and Pat

2012 Cruiser Patriot CF335SS.

2011 Silverado 3500HD LTZ CCLB Duramax SRW 4X4

https://i1193.photobucket.com/albums/...ailerKeuka.jpg
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Old 09-02-2013, 03:44 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NorskeNY
Just ordered the JT Strongarms from Tweetys.com. Looks like I will need to move the spare tire back too. have a similar layout of the gas lines.

Chucking - I have <!--if gte mso 9>
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I am sure my air bags help with the chucking as well - keep them at about 45psi and truck runs very level.

I find it funny that no matter what 3/4 ton or 1 ton truck you have that the OEM shocks go out so quick. Last two Super Duty trucks I have done the shocks by about 60,000 miles and they were shot - I guess GM has the same problem. Lighter duty shocks put in to save $$ and produce a softer ride, but they don't last.
__________________
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2013 CrossRoads Cruiser Patriot CF345RF
2011 Ford F350 Lariat FX4 CC 6.7L Turbo Diesel (Heavily Modified)
Saskatoon, SK
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Old 09-02-2013, 04:50 AM   #12
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Scott, I have the same model but a 2012, I was happy to read the review, we are very happy with ours, we bought it new in jan of 2013, this june we went a total of 2000 miles round trip to Westport California, it towed like a dream,. our tv is a 2006 f350 cc fitted with a bullet proof diesel oil and egr cooler. I would not own a 6.0 without this mod.
we have had a few minor problems, but nothing I would waste the time driving it to cw. a few loose trim boards, a few screws which needed attention. the major issue I had was a leak under the unit. found the kitchen sink pipe cracked above the grey tank it attaches too. instead of dealing with cw, I just removed the bottom board of the left facing island cupboard to access the pipe and redid the plumbing. even though the unit is under warranty for alittle more time, I find it easier to fix things right myself
the reliners do take some sitting time to make then alittle more comfortable, we plan to replace them with two ekorness recliners in the future

.




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Old 09-02-2013, 01:59 PM   #13
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Those Ekornes recliners are nice - I showed my wife - just a little concerned on the price as they do not look cheap. We really liked the Voyageur recliner with Ottoman. I'll have to price them out to see if they are reasonable enough for the trailer.
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Old 09-03-2013, 03:30 AM   #14
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Had a set of Ekornes in the house for fifteen years still a great recliner. They will run you around $1K each. So they are not cheap.
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Old 09-03-2013, 05:04 AM   #15
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Several of you mentioned in your posts Bilstein shocks as replacements for the OEMs.... I am not entirely happy wth the ride with and without 5vr being pulled, so would like to learn abouthow these helped. Also which model shock you bought. My issue isthe ride is a bit soft and mushy/sloppy...I don't have the confidence of much support.

Fifth wheel is 8500# (scales), 2010 F250 gas 20k miles. New 18" Michelin LTs. Pin weight ~1250#. Curt 16kslider.Pefect level truck and RV fully loaded, no sag or bounce. Travel with empty tanks.I have 5th Airborne pin box. Drives great, just don't like the mushy feel in the back of truck over various roads, lanes, bridges. I get no sway or movement as trucks/buses pass (sometimes see themwhen they get to my mirror, it rides that well on good surfaces). The ride empty is almost unacceptable... but as empty, not sure I can fix that. I looked for some threads for these shocks, but didn't find any, so if I missed one, please pass along as I didn't want to sidetrack this one.



BTW ... GREAT review of your experiences ... very helpful ...

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Old 09-03-2013, 11:52 AM   #16
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Rich you might want to go with an air bag system that you can adjust from the cab

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Old 09-03-2013, 02:10 PM   #17
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I would second the comments about installing air bags with a wireless controller for the cab. I had a system installed on my truck back in May and have not regretted it on bit.

I also appreciated the trip report since we have a very similar truck/trailer combination. Our experience during our summer trip to the Factory Rally and then to Niagara Falls was equally positive (though not as many miles and nothing through the mountains).
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Old 09-03-2013, 02:34 PM   #18
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Rich, most of us who drive 3/4 ton and 1 ton trucks whether gas or diesel find the OEM shocks wear out quickly due to the weight of our trucks. My previous 2005 F250 needed an upgrade to Bilsteins at 50,000 miles, I did my 2011 F350 at 55,000 miles. The ride is improved with a quality shock. I prefer the lifetime warranty of Bilsteins and put high miles on my trucks (my 2011 is already over 90,000 miles). There are other brands that see very good as well such as the real Rancho shocks, not the rebranded Ranchos Ford puts on the FX4 trucks which are still cheap crap.
If you ride level it is unlikely you may need the air bags but they do smooth out the ride when towing and get rid of the mushy feel - won't make as drastic a difference because you have a lower pin weight. I have the rear stabilizer and Bilstein shocks all around as well as the Bilstein steering stabilizer. I will post up the part numbers for you for the Bilstein 5100's - they are non-adjustable but improve the ride significantly.

Another option over air bags are the StableLoads by Torklift that can be turned on or off. Stiffen the ride while towing and return it to stock when not. Very low cost alternative. Do you have a camper package on your truck with 18" wheels - if so you likely have a rear sway bar and that will tighten your suspension and provide better handling but a rougher ride. I added the sway bar to my 2011 in order to further stabilize the truck when towing but it will reduce the ride quality.

Truck mods are kind of my specialty and I have done them all myself so feel free to ask away. I have modified every truck I have owned and many of my friends trucks as well - they all turn into a one of a kind when I'm done. Last week one evening in the campground 200 miles from home I was sitting outside and I said to my wife "there goes our old 2005 F250". She said "one like it?" I said "no, my old truck". It was about 300 ft away when it drove past and you couldn't miss it. Anyway I walked over and talked to the couple who bought it from me and they still just loved the truck and said they always get asked questions about it. Always happy to hear that when you sell a vehicle you looked after since I always take care of them and it looked after me well so happy to hear it is doing the same for them. Edited by: WildWildWest
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Old 09-03-2013, 04:40 PM   #19
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IF you are interested in looking at Bilstein's for your F250 it depends on your drivetrain. The Bilstein 5100 series are for 4-wheel drive trucks and 4600 series for 2 wheel drive. I don't think you will find too much onspecific shock upgradesposted in the CrossRoads website, most of this information comes from the truckforums and online research.

Bilstein Part #'s for 4 Wheel Drive 2010 F250
Part Number: 24-186018
Series</span>: 5100 Series
Drive Type</span>: 4WD
Position</span>: Front
Descriptor: Front Lifted Height: 0-2"

Part Number: 24-186025
Series</span>: 5100 Series
Drive Type</span>: 4WD
Position</span>: Rear
Descriptor: Rear Lifted
Height: 0-1"

Bilstein Part #'s for2 Wheel Drive 2010 F250

Part Number: 24-197779
Series</span>: 4600 Series
Drive Type</span>: RWD
Position</span>: Front

Part Number: 24-185325
Series</span>: 4600 Series
Drive Type</span>: RWD
Position</span>: Rear



Edited by: WildWildWest
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Old 09-03-2013, 11:29 PM   #20
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Rich - I purchase my shocks from http://www.kennedydiesel.com/. He does not have the 2010 F250 listed on his site but I am sure he could hook you up. had them on my previous trucks too - 2004 and 2005 GM - - installed them on those trucks as soon as I got them. Took care of "wheel hop" when unloaded.
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I use the Bilstein HD "yellow units" which I am told that they
provide the best handling, ride and control for both empty and loaded on road
driving.


My truck is a 3500HD and the air bags help to take the "rear end sag" after hitching up and improves the ride.

The air bags are not that hard to install - just need to jack up the body to make room for the unit to fit between the frame and the axle.

I do not use an on-board compressor - carry a pancake style compressor in the RV.

Air connections - under the plug area of the bumper - with the air lift sticker:









Edited by: NorskeNY
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