Pin Box Bolt Grade?

[Kamper Dave]

Spent the last week getting to know our new CF 31 RE10.

Today we noticed that one of the lower bolts on the pin box is installed on an angle.

It seems that the lock washer spun around and caught on the lower seam. It is very deformed (opened up) and not allowing the bolt head or nut tosit flat.

I will be replacing it. What hardness should I buy and to what torque should I twist it!!



There is a bolt in the upper and lower most holes AND thereis a hole between them where I wish to install an extra bolt on each side.



Thank you in advance for your help.

Kamper Dave

[fhenn]

Dave When I switch pin boxes I went to an 8 grade bolt. Torque them to 85 pounds check them at every stop on the next trip all has been good for a year now

[Stan]

When I installed my Glyderide box, I had grade 8 and I am pretty sure the manual said a lot more than 85 lbs. I remember because my torque wrench goes to 150 lbs and it wasn't enough torque for the spec required.

[cwit]

I have to agree with Stan I went to 175 witch is all my torque wrench will go to.

[rcflyer]

http://www.portlandbolt.com/technicalinformation/bolt-torque-chart.html Here is a torque table. I agree when replacing or adding bolts go with a grade 8. No harm if using more bolt than needed.

[BipeFlier]

Just because you use a grade 8 bolt doesn't necessarily require you to tighten it to the recommended torque. You really don't need a grade 8 as the boxes come with grade 5. Grade 8 certainly won't hurt, but isn't needed. I would torque to the recommended torque for the original bolts ( grade 5 ) as that is what the joint is designed for.

[Dayle1]

I would call Lippert or other frame manufacturer and see what is specified, both for grade and torque. I slightly disagree that adding more bolts or a higher grade is a good idea. There was an interesting topic on another forum about someone sheering bolts when he got stuck. Big recommendations were also more bolts and higher grade. I'd rather have the bolts sheer than cause frame damage due to too much force being applied to the frame. Much easier to check the bolts or replace them than checking the frame or repairing it. But that is my opinion.



Again to the OP, the incorrectly installed bolt should be replaced, go with what the frame manufacturer states, especially if it is still in warranty. If the hole is enlarged on either side, maybe add washers to get the proper fit, but again, find out what the manufacturer suggests.

[Kamper Dave]

Thank you all for the advice.
Kamper dave

[rcflyer]

The purpose of torqing a bolt to recommended values is to insure there is some bolt stretch. That is what keeps the bolt tight. If you use too little torque resulting in no bolt stretch the bolt may not stay tight.

[Kamper Dave]

rcflyer,

Thank you for the Portland Chart.

Something to think about:

Sorry to get this technical BUT I will not be able to easily get a torque wrench down inside of the pin box to reach thenut in question.

Portland data states that:

Torque is simply a measure of the amount of energy required to spin the nut up along the threads of a bolt, whereas tension is the stretch or elongation of a bolt.

Now I have tightend enough big bolts to know thatI can twist them to my full weight (200lbs plus) and thentighten the nut another 1/2 turn. SO, if I am torqing the bolt and not the nut; then what do I torque to?



I think I will callPortland's hot lineand Crossroadstomorrow.



Thanks again for the great Portaland data.

Kamper Dave

[Brad]

Lippert specs are 175 lbs against grade 8 bolts.

[mapachoo]

The value is the same nut or bolt.

[Kamper Dave]

I called Lippert (the pin box maufacturer):

#8 fasteners torqued to 110 lbs.

The more fasteners the better.

Kamper Dave

[Lloyd]

Originally Posted by Kamper Dave

I called Lippert (the pin box maufacturer):

#8 fasteners torqued to 110 lbs.

The more fasteners the better.

Kamper Dave

You should have asked them why they didn't use grade 8 bolts then. Mine sure didn't have them.

[Kamper Dave]

Worse than it looked.

Took off the nut so as to replace the lock washer.

The holes in the pin box frame and holes in the pin boxdo not aliegn perfectly.

The installer used the bolt in an attempt to drill out the hole. The threads are galled and thebolt could not sit flat if it wanted.



Wish I had spotted this before pulling it home.

[John B]

Originally Posted by Kamper Dave

Worse than it looked.

Took off the nut so as to replace the lock washer.

The holes in the pin box frame and holes in the pin boxdo not aliegn perfectly.

The installer used the bolt in an attempt to drill out the hole. The threads are galled and thebolt could not sit flat if it wanted.



Wish I had spotted this before pulling it home.

Just replace the grade fives or install grade 8s and torque them to a set of specs & go camping!! If you install the extras you were discussing it should out weigh any concerns you may have... Enjoy!!!

[John B]

[QUOTE=John B][QUOTE=Kamper Dave]Worse than it looked.

Took off the nut so as to replace the lock washer.

The holes in the pin box frame and holes in the pin boxdo not aliegn perfectly.

The installer used the bolt in an attempt to drill out the hole. The threads are galled and thebolt could not sit flat if it wanted.



Wish I had spotted this before pulling it home

[Kamper Dave]

After removing a couple of bolts and inspecting the interior it wasfound thatthe Pin Box was defective from the factory. Our dealer ordered a new pin box and sent a repairman to our home to install it. The new pin box was complete with a new hardware kit. There is now a bolt in every vacant pin box hole. Each nut is torqued to spec.

It tested good as we pulled over the Rockies and back with no problem.