Gorilla Cage Being Phased Out?

[hhh]

fixit, you may be correct, where I looked I saw a weld the full length of the joint. I looked at the wall pieces that were inside on the Cruiser assembly line. I thought I seen welds on two sides but I could be mistaken. I would think it would be difficult to weld the outside and inside as that is where the siding has to be attached and any "bumps" would not allow a flush fit. Wish I would have taken close up pic.

hunter, straight from the horses mouth (the factory rep) was they are doing it to save time and money.

edit: I found this pic of the floor. If you look at the center left side where the cutout is, you can see welds and here it would appears that it is welded on both sides of these tubes. But it does appear that the weld does not go completely to the corner but stops a faction before the corner.












Edited by: hhh

[fixit5561]

I dont know about the floor at all Maybe they do the floor different from the sides. All I can report is what I saw outside on the frames that were ready to go inside and be worked on. They had a tack weld on one side and the other side was welded across the tube.

[Hunter11]

"hunter, straight from the horses mouth (the factory rep) was they are doing it to save time and money."



Hank,I believe you but let's see it in writing either here on the forum or the Crossroads web site. And that may happen soon......
Edited by: Hunter11

[hhh]

Since Crossroads never comments on the forum I doubt you'll see it here

[Hunter11]

You never know....

[hhh]

Originally Posted by fixit5561

I dont know about the floor at all Maybe they do the floor different from the sides. All I can report is what I saw outside on the frames that were ready to go inside and be worked on. They had a tack weld on one side and the other side was welded across the tube.

Could be, I know there were some welded sidewalls inside and I thought they were welded both sides of the tube. I could be wrong but maybe the ones outside were not acceptable for production and that is why they are outside?

My understanding from the tour is that the frames are assembled inside just as they are ready to be installed on the floor. If you look at my pic, behind the floor framing you can see two sidewalls stacked on top of each other. The way they make them is to take an already assembled frame and secure it to the table. They then take the various tubes and lay them on top of this template and assemble the sidewall framing. On one table there was a stack of 5 assembled sidewall frames. From this table they are then moved to install on the floor of the trailer.

As you can see in the below pic, these sidewalls were screwed together.






Edited by: hhh

[ClassicHammond]

The last thing I would expect from the workforce at the Crossroads Factory is high turnover and low training.

And after welding for 10 years and watching robotics in the welding industry, my experience is whether it's a welder or a machine operator...the quality still is reliant onthe human.

And I've seen a lot of junk produced by an automatic welder, the thought processes of a machine have very little logic.

[drcook]

I took that last picture and magnified it. It appears that they were using angle pieces in the joints to screw the tubes together with. That would take time to cut and drill and screw. It is now understandable why they want to use welding. It is going to be a trade off as to the economics, and only time will tell.



They will have reduced costs from not using as many screws and angled pieces, plus the labor to cut and drill and install screws and the reduction of energy costs from the same. Offsetting this will be the cost of the welders (machines), energy costs from running the welders,increased heat in the rooms where the welding is done and the actual cost of the supplies that are used by which type of welder they employ (once again what machine type)



Add in the fact that only personneldoing the actual welding should be in the room unless protective eye wear is worn (which makes it hard to see),otherwise they are going to have increased Workman Comp claims due to staff getting their eyes burnt. I had my eyes burnt from a reflection off a white wall and could barely see for 3 days or so. I absolutely was not looking as I knew better. I did notknow that it could reflect from the wall and get me though.



If they get it up and running efficiently and address safety and quality issues, this could help them maintain profitabilityand stay in business, which is good for us.



Our Cruiser is a much much better piece of equipment than the old one we had. So I want them to stick around and be profitable.





Edited by: drcook

[Chrisnan23]

Not to belabor the costs but the angle brackets are stamped with the holes, very inexpensive, The reason I was given for using the brackets (several factory tours ago) was that they allow flexibility whereas the welds do not and that can cause cracking at the weld during traveling.

[hhh]

The angle brackets appear to be purchased already made to the correct size. The bracket has like a small gusset stamped into it when it is formed. The holes are already in the brackets and they use Tek screws so they don't have to drills holes in the tube. What I am surprised is that the screws actually hold, the aluminum tubes are really thin walled and there can't be much holding the screws in place. I would think that riveting them would be better but then holes would have to be drilled in the tubes. I would think it would hold better and be more consistant.

[mbinohio]

the turn over rate in the Rv business is as bad as fast food, the factory work is extremley hard and they work on a quota system, they are paid a fai wage and there is an incentive plan, for every unit that leaves the plant a certin amount of money goes into a kitty, and at the end of the quarter of the year the money is divided among the crew tht is left, but before the money is divided up all the cost of the warranty work is removed from the pot, so sometimes it's a few bucks and sometimes not....most of the labor moves from one plant to the next, sme as the uppermanagement people and other than some hight end line there is no quality control, everybody is supposed to watch wht's going on and keep the money from going to the warranty work and not them........to think they use highly trained and an educated workforce is far, far from the truth...

[mwebber78]

Great conversation and pictures. However, it'd be nice if certian folks would allow conversations that are pro or con Crossroads choices and direction without complaining some people no longer own one. I still advocate to others how much I loved my CR. It's condescending and counter productive to this great forum and group of owners.



I'd have bought a CR in a flash if they made a Class C....

[Hunter11]

Y'all hang on, I need to pop some popcorn and get a cold drink.

[mwebber78]

Nah Hunter



I'm sure we can keep it civil and on topic. On a separate note it's nice to see pictures from the rally and factory. The construction pictures are great and I hope CR keeps their hung walls. They didn't talk about those did they?

[Tom Holsinger]

Originally Posted by mwebber78

However, it'd be nice if certian folks would allow conversations that are pro or con Crossroads choices and direction without complaining some people no longer own one.

'cuz it's their party, and they'll cry if they want to



http://www.lyricsdepot.com/lesley-go...-my-party.html

"IT'S MY PARTY
Lesley Gore

Nobody knows where my Johnny has gone
Judy left the same time
Why was he holding her hand
When he's supposed to be mine

It's my party, and I'll cry if I want to
Cry if I want to, cry if I want to
You would cry too if it happened to you

Playin' my records, keep dancin' all night
Leave me alone for a while
'Till Johnny's dancin' with me
I've got no reason to smile

It's my party, and I'll cry if I want to
Cry if I want to, cry if I want to
You would cry too if it happened to you

------ LEAD BREAK ------

Judy and Johnny just walked through the door
Like a queen with her king
Oh what a birthday surprise
Judy's wearin' his ring

It's my party, and I'll cry if I want to
Cry if I want to, cry if I want to
You would cry too if it happened to you"

[Hunter11]

What RV do you own Tom?

[drcook]

We have a Featherlite aluminum horse trailer and every seam is welded. It does add to the cost as Featherlite's are pricey. Ours was in a hail storm so we got it at a reduced price otherwise we would have chosen one of the other brands

[dalemac377]

Like I said in an earlier post, I would prefer the screw and clip construction because that has been perfected over the years by Crossroads. That being said, the gorilla cage will still exist, it will just be a welded structure now. Time will tell if it will be as reliable as the screw and clip construction has proven to be. JMHO.

[Chrisnan23]

Originally Posted by dalemac377

Like I said in an earlier post, I would prefer the screw and clip construction because that has been perfected over the years by Crossroads. That being said, the gorilla cage will still exist, it will just be a welded structure now. Time will tell if it will be as reliable as the screw and clip construction has proven to be. JMHO.

X2

[drcook]

at least it contributed to a lively discussion